@calizaybak.bsky.social: If all the hostages were returned today that would not end the war because the underlying causes; apartheid policies not only would remain but would continue apace. I've been hearing that most Israelis despise Bibi for years now, yet there he remains in power so what are we to make of that?

War is the only way the war criminal can keep power and to be fair most of Israel seems happy enough to go along with his evil lunacy.

Bibi is pretty clearly now actively working to prevent a hostage/ceasefire deal. The man is a deranged lunatic who belongs in jail. www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog-jul...

Netanyahu issues list of Israeli demands as hostage-truce talks slated to restartwww.timesofisrael.com IDF major killed fighting in Rafah * Thousands rally nationwide demanding hostage release deal * Soldier and two civilians -- including US citizen -- wounded in Hezbollah attack

Pretty clearly most of Israel is not happy to go with it. There have been consistent mass protests for several weeks now. He's coalition is decisively defeated in every single poll.

He's been in power for 10 years despite being a regular and war criminal and running an apartheid state, so I think those polls might have more gravitas. And I've seen polling like this:

Most Israelis dislike Netanyahu, but support the war in Gaza – an Israeli scholar explains what’s driving public opiniontheconversation.com Israelis’ and Jewish people’s long-held feeling of persecution, dating back to biblical times, contributes to most Israelis’ desire to continue the war in Gaza.

Poll: Half of Jewish Israelis say Israel should run Gaza after the war; 0% say Hamaswww.timesofisrael.com Survey conducted in March finds only 19% of Israeli Jews believe peaceful coexistence possible with Palestinian state -- lowest since Pew Institute began polling Israelis in 2013

Israeli polls show Netanyahu party narrowing gap behind Gantzwww.reuters.com Both polls showed a majority of voters would prefer Gantz as prime minister in a head-to-head choice with Netanyahu.

How does that prove your original point? It contradicts it.

Gantz is for continuing war on Gaza like Bibi, he just wants it more effective towards a "true victory". There are many Israelis appalled at the war crimes, and they're out there bravely protesting, teachers getting fired from their jobs for speaking out even. That's the minority.

Gantz announces he is leaving coalition, says Netanyahu preventing ‘true victory’www.timesofisrael.com * * *

Most Israelis support the war in Gaza. Sure. Most Israelis also support ending the war in Gaza in exchange for the hostages. Most Israelis despise Bibi. Hamas =/= Palestinians. Bibi=/= Israelis. Insisting otherwise against data makes you seem unserious.

If all the hostages were returned today that would not end the war because the underlying causes; apartheid policies not only would remain but would continue apace. I've been hearing that most Israelis despise Bibi for years now, yet there he remains in power so what are we to make of that?

If all hostages were returned today and Bibi was not PM the war would absolutely end.

And a two-state solution would begin to form? Or would it go back to what lead up to the terrorist attacks and the cycle begins anew?

I honestly have no idea. But ending the war is good in and of itself. And I'm also pretty sure Bibi will not remain in power, which is also a good outcome.

I think it would not because before Oct 7 there was no majority political will for such a thing, just a continuation of the apartheid policies and human rights abuses. Bibi out of power would be great, and end to this war, even better, but if all the things that lead to that don't change?

It's bad. And will require int'l pressure to change. But can we agree that ending the war and ending Bibi's rule is good? Both are achievable. Let's unite around that for now.

Oh on that point we are in total agreement, that stops the bleeding and would be good to be absolutely sure but the chronic condition remains critical and Israel's politics have no party that I am aware who wants to address the underlying condition. They seem to want to keep doing more the same.

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