Amanda Marcotte: The discussion about persuading Biden. To offer a counterpoint to the yes-men he's surrounded himself with. But mostly it continues to be astonishing that folks believe it will be easier to shut up the entire media and millions of voters with concerns than to ask Biden to do the right thing.

The discussion about persuading Biden. To offer a counterpoint to the yes-men he's surrounded himself with. But mostly it continues to be astonishing that folks believe it will be easier to shut up the entire media and millions of voters with concerns than to ask Biden to do the right thing.

There’s nothing wrong with looking at a candidate’s fitness for office. I understand the concerns a lot of people express about Biden. I felt the same way after that miserable debate. But the discussion’s over unless Biden changes his mind, because today he made it clear that he’s not quitting.

It does not speak well of Biden that his biggest defenders think it's harder to reason with him than it is to browbeat millions of people into silence.

Sarah Longwell reports that in her post-debate focus group of Clinton-Biden voters, three said they can't vote for Biden now. They aren't voting Trump. They just won't vote. Extrapolate that out over the swing states and you're talking thousands of people, far more than Trump needs to win.

I reject the idea that it's easier to talk thousands of people in swing states to pretending they didn't see what they saw than it is for Biden to just say, "Yeah, I thought I had this, but life comes at you fast when you're 81."

I've been in this business a long time and find that when people go into "shut up shut up shut up" mode, it's rarely because they think silencing people will actually achieve the stated goal. It's usually because they don't have a good rebuttal and so they blame the person bringing up the points.

Anyway, if the goal is getting people to suck it up and vote Biden if he won't drop out, then "shut up" won't get you there. "Yes, it's shitty that he's so selfish he's using our fear of Trump to get what he always wanted, but still, it's about your future not his," is a better move.

It IS selfish and I will be bitter about it forever. How dare they put us in this danger.

You must have the same long time info on him I do It is not abt the people, never has been, he has always put his beliefs first. Actually how we got here. Cannot fathom why people do not get, that Repukes did not pull this shit w any other Dem POTUS bc they have been planning take over since 1920s

A completely incoherent political position. I do not understand what these people think they are doing

But also there is such a thing as recency bias.

I'm not sure that immediate reactions after a debate in June are accurate predictors of behavior in November. A lot will happen in those months, minds will be changed.

Actually, us Biden defenders think the hardest people to reason with are those who run scared at the slightest issue, rather than having a spine and standing up to the bullshit.

bsky.app/profile/fply...

There ain't no other ship. People talking about replacing Biden are like the people who went to the roofs of the WTC on 9/11, thinking big airplanes and helicopters would save them. No; this is it and we need to make sure this horse wins.

The man openly says he refuses to prove he can be alert at night. It's disqualifying and it makes all of us look like a cult just as bad as MAGA.

Um, no. What a crappy take. I know 40 year olds that go to bed by 9. How do you magically forget the last 3.5 yrs he's been in office? How do you forget the 4 yrs Trump was in? How do you forget the lies, the theft (he stole from cancer patients), the threats, and the people he put on SCOTUS?

That is a false equivalence and you shouldn't be caught in it. There is no comparison to MAGA here. When you allow yourself to get caught in that, you limit your choices. As was said on "The Owl House", they aren't coming from the same place we are, so don't make us into them.

it doesn't make us into them.

Who is browbeating millions of people into silence when the NYT has 5 stories a day about how no one, from people who enthusiastically voted for him in 2020 to Senator Mark Warner, wants him to stay in the race? This is serious question.

65% of voters say Biden is too old. That's not just millions you are trying to silence. It's a couple hundred million. Sorry, don't think you can shut them up. www.dataforprogress.org/blog/2024/6/...

In Post-Debate Poll, Voters Think Biden Is Too Old to Be President Yet Alternative Candidates Perform Similarly Against Trumpwww.dataforprogress.org Only 51% of Democrats and 35% of all likely voters say that Joe Biden should remain as the Democratic nominee for the 2024 presidential election.

How am I silencing anyone? I am an academic editor & poster on BlueSky. If I happen to think and express, contra some other Dems, that it makes more sense for Biden to stay in the race than not, how does that turn me into a movie villain? Hate the DNC if you want (I'm not a fan), but who is "you"?

Oh, you know [general hand wave in several directions], *you*

A couple hundred million voters? Um, I think you need to check your math.

And about as many say that Trump is too old, and a convicted felon, and generally unhinged. Are you asking Trump to drop out? If not, why not?

Please don’t put words in my mouth. I didn’t even mention “shutting up the media,” and I’m well aware that may be impossible.

Show me those millions. WaPo found a dozen. We know the old thing is mainly being driven by Russian disinfo. What really is astonishing to me is how many people get convinced that Biden should drop out after the debate and totally ignore that Trump is not being asked to drop out for worse reasons.

sorry, Amanda, this is just garbage. You're letting yourself get snowed by a Russian disinfo campaign. It's like every damned pundit has lost their everloving MINDS. I don't know what y'all's problem is, but I'm gobsmacked. Oh, I'm not ignorant, either. But I think y'all are being played.

Or, possibly, it more about the media dogpiling an old candidate with communication issues and giving a free pass to to a lying and mentally-incompetent felon. Balance the coverage and we’re likelier to pay attention to you.

Time to get really serious about the 25th Amendment