You wouldn't download a frog: You're assuming you can work, yes. Children, old people and people in hospital are supported by "handouts from the state." If people want to eliminate those because handouts lack dignity, that's a right-wing project. You've absorbed the shame people cast for being on benefits - no dignity there!!

I am British and excited about our upcoming moderate Left government. There are things I disagree with them on! That’s OK, I can give my all to influencing them and they might actually pay attention, unlike a right wing government which definitely won’t.

Are you talking about the party whose leader said last week that "handouts from the state" don't have the same dignity as working for a wage?

Uhm - here's a little thought experiment. Which would you rather do in life - work for a living (at a decent wage), or exist on benefits handed to you by the state? Why? I can't know your answer, obviously, but having done both, I know mine, and dignity has a lot to do with it.

You're assuming you can work, yes. Children, old people and people in hospital are supported by "handouts from the state." If people want to eliminate those because handouts lack dignity, that's a right-wing project. You've absorbed the shame people cast for being on benefits - no dignity there!!

You’re being disingenuous. No-one’s saying children or ill people or old people should work (tho’ a lot of old people do choose to despite not needing to, the why of which is also worth thinking about.) We’re contrasting a working age life at work or on benefit. So what’s your preference & why?

Incidentally, when I was on benefit, I wasn’t ashamed, because I (1) had no choice and (2) had paid into the system my whole working life and expected to do so again soon. But I didn’t like it, because (like most people, I think) I like to carry my own weight, not have someone else carry it for me.

When it was you-in-particular receiving benefits, you-in-particular didn't lack self-reliant dignity, I got it. Starmer must be talking about everyone else on benefits, not you.

Mate, let it go. You heard Naomi. We’re done here.

RWers in my country definitely say children should work. Something about dignity ... You can have your contrasts. The question before us is: what does a politician stating that benefits lack dignity probably plan to do with benefits? floridaphoenix.com/2024/02/01/f...

FL House approves rollback of child labor laws, letting teens to work more than 30 hours a week • Florida Phoenixfloridaphoenix.com The Florida House of Representatives passed legislation Thursday easing child labor restrictions to allow 16- and 17-year-olds to work the same hours as adults. Democrats tried several times to modify...

so listen friends. I spent my childhood trying to explain my parents to each other and although I'm good at it it's not my fave anymore. you are both right. people like to work on good things if they can. people who can't work (or can't right now) should not be told they therefore lack dignity.

I am up for having this in my mentions if you can keep it to "friendly good faith conversation about what we'd like our government to do". if it gets much more aggro than this I will block and thereby end the chat.

Nah, it’s fine Naomi - I’m done. Don’t do SM combat, life’s too short.

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