John Scalzi: Honestly if money were made unnecessary to live we would almost certainly be getting more art out of people, not less, let's make money superfluous to existence and find out

Honestly if money were made unnecessary to live we would almost certainly be getting more art out of people, not less, let's make money superfluous to existence and find out

“if money was abolished would you still make content?” is the most insane AI bullshit i have ever heard in my life i was making art and drawing way before i was making money for it how fucking corrupt are these pieces of shit? money is barely part of the equation. its only there cause i NEED IT

I think about my dad, who spent 42 years teaching piano at Penn State and, now that he is retired and no longer dependent on the piano for his income, he…plays the piano just as much as ever, if not more

My dad is spending his retirement relearning to play the guitar because he didn't have the time or energy to do it when he was still working.

I have friends who are retired university piano professors who host small free concerts in their home about once a month. They're also writing a biography of a little known Scottish pianist & we get to enjoy readings from it & hear how her work has influenced their playing. It's a pure delight.

My grandfather was a mechanical engineer who took up building kit airplanes as a hobby when he retired. Not a 1:1 jump but pretty clearly in the same ballpark

I'd make very little "content" but A LOT of art. 😄

🎯

This is The Way

a lot of people in the tech world do not seem to understand that most people - i would wager the vast majority of people - find the act of creating to be intrinsically rewarding

Tech is my day job, but I need art, both as audience and artist, to appreciate living. I fully agree with you.

Hear, hear. I have been EXTREMELY lucky in most cases to end up working at places where I can say "I'm playing a show X night / We're doing a weekend warrior tour, so I need Thursday/Friday/Monday off", but a LOT of us aren't.

A lot of folks in the tech world create, these just arent the ones saying all the crazy bits (well, sometimes they are) The sheer count of programming languages, editors, even custom OSs is lovely to see and a ton of fun to make MBAs dont know how to make or create

Hell, look at everything Vincent van Gogh painted--and in a relatively short span. He sold one painting in his lifetime. (Wrote a one man show about him years ago, and the research had an effect on how I view making my own art, even if it's theatre & podcasting.)

Once we (as a society) moved past fulfilling our animal needs of food and shelter, we turn towards fulfilling our sentient needs. We need Art. We do not need money. Money needs false scarcity and ever more consumption of products. Art is not consumable. Art uplifts and endures and so much more.

My photography makes me happy. I’m 100% going to be that retired guy with a good camera who basically lives at the nature centers/raised boardwalks doing wildlife photography. I’d love to have more time to make art

LOL I've been pricing old 35mm cameras and lenses on eBay. I am totally going to be that guy, too.

(And in case anyone is wondering: they're very reasonable! Especially classic manual bodies and lenses! Even film itself isn't that pricey, once you figure in inflation.)

Particularly if you shoot B&W film & process it yourself.

I did darkroom in high school and it was incredible and really kickstarted my interest, but the chemicals are increasingly hard to find, not to mention the space. But there’s nothing quite like the magic of watching it develop before your eyes. Sticking to digital though.

That's a fantastic shot.

Thank you! FWIW if I ever do manual, I’m paying the $300 to restore my grandpa’s old Rollei. It needs a new timing spring.

Universal Basic Income would keep disabled people, who keep being locked out of employment, out of poverty. #Autism

And so UBI keeps being prevented. 🤬

I can only conclude that the people who think otherwise have never been artists, writers, or musicians. I've been a professional musician for decades. I don't do it because there's money in it (there isn't much) - I do it because I can't *not* do it and be me! Needing to make money gets in the way!

I also think there would be masses of mediocre art. That's a possibility that James S.A. Corey missed in their Leviathan Wakes novels with "Basic": "The Museum of Mediocre Arts" It covers hundreds of square kilometers in Siberia. And every ten years, there's a vote on what art to keep.

I have bad news for you about the current state of affairs

Yeah, "but if everyone was allowed to freely make art there would be a lot of bad art!" is not an argument that stands up to even casual examination.

Not necessarily bad art, but if I extrapolate from the art I'd do there would be a lot of mediocre art. Solid 5.0 on a scale of 1 to 10. Really bad art (honest 1.0) is actually rare and in that also worth seeing.

I mean, replace "bad" in my sentence with "mediocre" and it's still not a good argument. Like, "if this happens humans will breathe oxygen!" ok. And so? Also, like breathing, the act of making art of any quality is good for humans. I want all the art in the world, of any quality.

Also just because a human makes art doesn't mean that they have to share or get pro recognition for it. Hobbies are fine! We're allowed to make things just to make them! * I'm even taking this stance as an Asian American perfectionist. Art-making is good for people, even if they're not good at it.

Bad and mediocre art are both 100% capable of adding to the net sum of happiness and joy in this universe.

"I want all the art in the world, of any quality." THIS, 💯! I'd rather have people happily making bad art than being miserable slaving away for corporations and tech bros their whole lives. plus because art is subjective, somebody out there might like it!

At an even more basic level: Having fun is good, actually. If I had more leisure time, I'd go swimming with my kid more often. Are we Olympic-standard swimmers? Nope. So what? Our swimming doesn't have to meet a quality standard to be worth doing. Same goes for making a song, or picture, or story.

Also which situation is more likely to produce mediocre art? People trying to make something with mass appeal so they can earn a living, or people who have the free time to make art without worrying about making a profit off it. I know which I think

I'd argue that not all art should be good. I've recieved a shit ton of joy from art I know is pretty mid. Sometimes I want to turn my brain off and watch ppl have fun. Sometimes I want high art. Both are necessary. Also art is always subjective, so what is "mediocre" anyway?

Setting aside the subjectivity of how one decides what is or isn’t mediocre, every artist responsible for art you consider great has a boatload of mediocre art they made on the way there.

And perceptions change as well. During his life, everyone though Van Gogh was a shit painter.

Many talented artists started out "mediocre." They improved because they were able to practice their craft. In a world where we aren't all tied to things like cost of living, many more people would have that freedom.

I’m concerned that if money goes away and we all start making bad art, who will create all the bad spreadsheets? The subpar project update emails? For goodness sake, who will create all the mediocre meeting minutes?

* do a shot of bourbon and say Mediocre Meeting Minutes ten times fast. Do another if you mess up. Repeat until the floor rushes up to meet you

I’d hypothesize there would also be a lot more great art, and maybe the fuzzy ratio between the two would remain about constant.

Make more mediocre art! This is not a bad thing!

What about the viewer/reader/critic/curator in this? Mostly it is the audience who get to decide what is ‘great’, and there’s a lot of contingency and disagreement involved.

I guess if there’s no money involved, more people get to engage with more art, which might mean a wider range is considered good.

And without the chance to make bad/mediocre art, plenty of people will never reach the ability to make good art.

Think of all that delightful human expression we'd get. And if a hundred thousand people still only make stick figure pictures and little scribbles, it wouldn't matter, because there would be more *joy* in the making of it.

there's an apochryphal anecdote about stalin when he asked his minister for culture how much money the ussr spends on making movies "6.5 million rubles", came the answer "how many movies does that make?" "800" "and how many of them are good?" "about 5" "so why don't we just make those 5 then?"

also, from a broader perspective, not everyone would make art but people would make stuff i'd still continue to write software just like i used to before i earned money with it other people would make other stuff: chairs, jumpers, maybe even innovative jams

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