Popehat: Classic American political dialogue is premised on the idea that we share fundamental values but disagree on how best to promote them. I haven’t believed this for a while. Other than “I prefer to be alive and not dead” and “I like pudding,” I do not share values with these people.

Classic American political dialogue is premised on the idea that we share fundamental values but disagree on how best to promote them. I haven’t believed this for a while. Other than “I prefer to be alive and not dead” and “I like pudding,” I do not share values with these people.

Yep. One of the biggest blind spots people have is assuming that underneath, others share the same basic values as them. They have trouble imagining an ideology that is completely misaligned with theirs.

Pudding is over-rated and I've got clinical depression, so there are definitely times I did not prefer to be alive. Oh, that's fucking dark. I stopped believing they wanted what was best for the country after Obama was elected and I saw the...problematic responses following it.

A lot of people did right around that time.

I used to believe this, but have been reading about George Wallace, TX politics, the influence of oil and Evangelicalism and I gotta say that around 40% of the country is just nuts.

The "crazification" percent of the population is around 28%. Basically the ppl whose voting patterns could just as well be explained by massive head trauma. That was the percent that voted for Alan Keyes a couple decades ago in Illinois and that number keeps repeating over and again.

I think the number might be higher now. Wallace pulled in 30+% in '68 and his voters are still out there (see the anti-Kamala bullshit). Trump had 46.8% in 2020--accounting for people (looking at you, Philly!) who didn't vote and I think you get to around 40%.

Speaking of a shit number, Philly's vote in 2020 was 66% of registered voters--best showing since 1984. Still, way too low in a city with a 6-1 D to R ratio.

O/T Saw your profile and I used to love going Irish dancing in Savannah when I was in 24th/3rd ID. Bunch of soldiers would caravan from Ft Stewart to Savannah with assorted girlfriends etc for dance and Guinness back around 1995. God that was a blast. We actually got pretty good.

I found slip jigs to be tricky however. Reels were the best

Trump effect may be operative, yes

💯

The divide is even worse than simply not sharing the same values. We don't even share the same reality/facts.

Thats what happens when we stop letting church be what you do in your own time behind closed doors and instead let every maladjusted freak who narrowly kept it prodromal have a seat at the table if they can get enough credulous assholes to send them a check because they like the tone of their hate.

On that note, I'd say here in Kansas we share the same values (love of family, country, etc) but not the same reality. Trump-leaning & general GOP folks around here claim to want the same things we want. They also think Trump is a Christian, so they are delusional. Back to: different realities.

Not at all sure about the first one given their attitudes toward guns, disease and climate change

They clearly do not prefer that *we* be alive.

That's obviously true but they're not big on self-preservation either, e.g. drinking H5N1 milk to own the FDA

They have significantly bad capabilities for risk assessment and a belief in their own invulnerability that the rest of us grew out of as teenagers.

"Things will turn out fine because I don't have the capacity to understand the reality of the alternative"

Between that and the "ain't nobody gonna tell me what to do" attitude, a lot of them seem to have peaked around 16 and never grown up any since.

This seems to describe an unnerving amount people’s attitude to current realities (climate change, Covid, fascism, etc).

If they're rich, they're shielded from a lot of the everyday problems the average person has to deal with. Wealth is a buffer from reality.

No offense, but bad example. How about not masking, not vaxxing, not observing safe distancing for a bizarre concept called "FreeDumb." No, I'm NOT going to be careful becuz I'll defy to my death what the libs tell me do. Eff You Libs. Buh-bye dumb ass. Alas, this is what my conservative uncle did.

I was trying to think of something that's straightforward suicide rather than refusal to protect others

In the name of unity, I endorse their efforts.

its been easier since half the country has basically decided all they care about is how much the ppl they dont like suffer

Not nearly half. Shallow waters run noisily

Maybe 30-35? [Eeesh, finding out one-third of my own country's citizens are basically proto-fascists was a _bummer_.]

John Rogers' colleague Tyrone pegged it a little lower than that, but things may have changed in almost twenty years. kfmonkey.blogspot.com/2005/10/lunc...

Lunch Discussions #145: The Crazification Factorkfmonkey.blogspot.com John: ... I mean, what will it take? That last speech literally made no sense . It was crazy drunken bar talk! Islamic radicals are lik...

I don't doubt you're right, John. I just guesstimated their numbers, but there's no way in the world they're the majority they pretend to be. They're just very noisy and squeaky-wheely.

Just like in Lincoln's Cooper Union speech, "what will convince them? This, and this only: cease to call slavery wrong, and join them in calling it right." Some values are irreconcilable.

And even pudding was a little questionable after learning how much DeSantis loves to shovel it in his mouth.

That's sad. Don't let DeSantis ruin pudding for you. That's like letting him win.

It's okay my mere existence causes him untold amounts of pain so it must hurt him when I have a pudding cup.

This is the real truth that the right's embrace of Trump reveled to me. I may have known before but watching the grotesque valueless shit show made the reality impossible to ignore.

Problem is, I'm not even sure if those people prefer to be alive anymore; considering how eager they are to do stuff that increases their chances of dying.

Far too many of them are looking forward to “meeting their maker,” & are gleefully awaiting the apocalypse. 🤦🏻‍♂️

Yes. This is the distinction between "opponents" and "enemies". Opponents may believe different things than you, but you can work with them. Enemies? No, enemies are enemies. Politics involve strange bedfellows, but in the end an enemy is an enemy.

I'm still trying to swallow this. Not pudding. I can swallow plenty of that.

Every time CA catches on fire, when people are dying, right wingers (MANY) have to comment how thrilled they are, that they have no sympathy, it's what we deserve, etc. Absolutely depraved! White men are truly out of control. I have no solutions

California is not a land of unending blue bleeding heart liberals. CA elected Ahnold Schwartznegger twice as governor. He's not Marjorie Three Toes, but no one would confuse the Terminator with Nancy Pelosi.

I live here. I'm clear on that.

Oh, my point is that Repubs dancing on the graves of Californians, are dancing on some of their fellow travelers. But I guess they're rejoicing over their ignorant beliefs, not reality. Hope that clears it up.

I don't believe they consider any of us "fellow travelers" No matter where they are from they are universally hateful and dehumanizing. Basically the GOP platform!

Not just some. There were more Trump voters in California than just about any state other than Texas in 2020.

Surround by at least 6 million wing nuts. Super depressing!!

DUDE shut up if they think libs like pudding they'll try to ban it

I’m never going to get along with the “fuck your feelings” crowd.

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