HUGE!!! Platformer, one of Substack’s biggest publications, announces it will leave the platform if leadership won’t reverse course on banning nazis.
They’re meeting with them this week to discuss.
www.platformer.news/p/openais-ne...
I’m not sure there’s any ‘saving’ substack even if they’re successful - how much content do we *really* want to commit to the care of the team that chose to fight *for* the nazis?
Them snitching to Stripe will probably do it, unless the far right has figured out how to work the refs for payment processors too. Those processors don't fuck around.
To me this kind of reads like preparing their slides for the Stripe presentation. "They're gonna ask if we raised these issues with Substack, so let's get SS on record telling us to go pound sand."
Or: "Our presentation will be stronger if we can show that SS is definitely aware of the extent of the problem. So let's document that we showed them."
Your points are spot on. Also, these companies are worth millions (SS) and billions (Stripe), which means they've got a lot to lose in potential litigation. Nazis are the absolute scum of the earth; w/ nowhere to go but up, any failed attempt to oust them will only make them see more legit
To quote my man Omar from Baltimore, "you come at the king, you best not miss." The idea that, in this situation, Platformer should "pull rank" and go directly to Stripe w/o dotting I's and crossing T's is...let's just say it's not correct
Yeah, I'd just have worded it as "we are definitely going to Stripe with this issue afterwards regardless."
Even if they back down, taking the issue to the payment processor narrows their opportunities to reverse themselves on backing down.
The problem is that US conservatism has gone so fascist that a lot of these companies don't want to outright ban hate so as not to appear "partisan." It's fuckin gross
Yep, and if Stripe won't bite, go to the credit card companies themselves and ask if they really want to be in business with a company that processes payment for a Nazi-friendly website.
substack has had the policy of intentionally courting and even recruiting right wing zealots since 2020-2021. this will change nothing. it’s irresponsible, frankly.
Sure, but not everyone is out there actively looking for anti-nazi info, sadly.
I think Stripe *should* care from a purely business perspective. Being seen to be palling around with authoritarian extremists is bad business if you're even moderately PR-exposed.
There was a good point made elsewhere on the thread that going through Substack first as a box-ticking exercise before going to Stripe makes sense, so that they can say: "yes, we aired our concerns straight to your customer. They blew us off after we made them explicitly aware and brought lists."
who exactly are you giving a pass for “not actively looking for anti-nazi info” exactly?
because it’s literally been *in the news* over & over since early 2020 that substack is effectively a nazi bar.
Why bother debating sticking around at this point? The bar has been a Nazi bar for a while now. It doesn't matter if they promise to hide the memorabilia starting next week
Question one from the payment provider will be if these issues have been raised. “We have, and they said they would rather stand with the Nazis” is the answer Stripe needs before cutting off services.
If they get Substack to reverse course, I'd leave mine up and post occasionally, but to me, the damage is done. I won't trust another platform to be a main hub for my work again. It'd be nice to be able to keep in touch with fellow writers if they do change their mind.
It's pretty awful how appealing to what's morally correct has zero leverage but money moves things
I mean of course use whatever leverage is necessary, but it's still sad
My understanding is that Substack wouldn't allow sex workers on the platform primarily because Stripe refuses to work with them. In that respect SS was okay with limiting free speech.
Very heartening, especially smart to bring the payment processing co into this. After all, if we go by the rules of free speech, everything Substack chooses to platform in a space they control is in fact a manifestation of their own freedom of speech.
I love that they won’t just leave the platform, but they’re getting Stripe involved! If Stripe leaves, Substack would need to find another payment processor (which would be okay with nazis) and integrate it into their system. That’s a huge issue!
While it would be nice for the Substack team to finally realize "Stripe could shut us down", at this point, if they continue to refuse to change, I truly hope Stripe shuts them down and causes them to go bankrupt, as painful as that would be to good, honest, legitimate substack users.
How is there any fucking debate around this? Nazis = bad. That was decided by the found himself when he down a cyanide pill with a 7.65mm chaser in 1945.
