Prop 13 is, in terms of economic damage inflicted, probably the worst law in the entire country and, if the judiciary actually enforced the constitution, blatantly unconstitutional.
I don't *really* care but the "I bought 40 years ago and couldn't afford to stay in my house if I had to pay the real tax rate" argument is so easy to address - allow low-income or elderly homeowners to defer the increased taxes until they either die or sell the house. bsky.app/profile/ryan...
also wild how the only possible justification is “me, wealthy old person who bought in low and already paid off my house, would like to continue to pay no taxes on my 10xed asset”
i wonder how much the prices would drop if people knew they weren’t locking themselves in at the current tax base. Some money shifts from going to the seller to be paid out over time in taxes.
I have no idea how the “fine, we’ll keep prop 13 for your home but we’re going to remove it for businesses” prop failed a few years ago.
Well, I know how but you know what I mean
Had a property dispute with my neighbors — early 60s, woman had never worked, guy retired at 61, had at least $1MM in equity due to appreciation alone — who told me “we’re seniors on a fixed income!” as justification for their bullshit. These people actually think they’re poor!
part of the new law (prop 19) passed in 2020 is even MORE unconscionable.
it allows seniors to buy a new home at market rate but to keep their BELOW MARKET TAX RATE from their PREVIOUS home they sold!!!
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_Ca...
as of 2022, only if the home is used as their primary residence, CA voters narrowly passed a measure eliminating the ability to inherit prop 13 rates on investment properties (in exchange for letting existing senior homeowners transfer their prop 13 privileges to new primary residences)
ya tho my understanding is that they can't use it "trade up" - if the new property is assessed to be more valuable than the old property then the difference is taxed at normal rates and doesn't inherit the favorable prop 13 rate from 1979 or whatever
basically to allow CA seniors to move to smaller homes or rural areas without giving up their low assessment rates. not how I'd do it but certainly worth the tradeoff of ending the egregious inheritance-of-rental-properties thing
Also there’s a cap on the tax base preservation. I don’t know the exact formula but basically if the house is too $$$, the tax base isn’t entirely preserved and the more $$$ the less it’s preserved.
Yeah to the extent this was a real problem, it was obviously seized on as an opportunity to kneecap (progressive) govt.
Similar late 70s dynamic w stagflation (real problem) and opportunistic solution (planned monetary recession w no planned protections for sacrificial working class)
Anyway, a tax solely on site value will drive housing prices down as real estate speculators stop holding undeveloped land out of use. And if the revenue is dedicated to a UBI, most people will come out ahead.
It's self-fulfilling, because one of the reasons the tax rates and valuations are so high is because of the properties that are locked in at low valuations.
But we can't unwind that now.
Could they just.. sunset it? Eventually it would die off with the last of the owners who were eligible? Wouldn’t fix anything now, but better than just not doing anything about it at all?
I also like letting people deed their house so it can't be sold more than what they paid + inflation since then. Then you can tax them on the deeded, capped value since that's all they'll ever be able to sell it for
And furthermore this can be accomplished with no legal change because the bank will happily lend against your house to pay your taxes unless you are insanely overleveraged
Part of the problem is that property taxes are a horribly inequitable way to pay for local government—on the side of the people paying and the people receiving government services. Income taxes (calibrated to include the money rich people live on) are generally much fairer.
also wild how the only possible justification is “me, wealthy old person who bought in low and already paid off my house, would like to continue to pay no taxes on my 10xed asset”
My parents and their friends supported this stupid proposition and benefit from it, saying they couldn’t possibly pay more in property taxes, all while they go gallivanting around the world on expensive trips…
on the other hand, it’s always funny when a right-wing californian who moved to texas to be based and trad gets their first property tax estimate in the mail
I just googled SF property tax (for a newly bought home) and was shocked to see a number below 1%? Pretty sure mine is between 3 and 4. Not a big deal for my cheap house, but still
you know, you might be right. from what i can find, the average CA -> TX migrant is upper-middle-income, so many of them may never have seen a property tax bill before.
Become a minister in the Universal Life Church. Do something of value to the community. Do not scam the IRS to avoid income tax. Donate your house to the church. In turn, the church provides you use of the house as a Rectory and Sanctuary. Church buildings are exempt from property tax.
I've actually considered buying land and establishing a Temple of Hekate and offering tax free plots to fellow witches. Not sure how the legal part would work but I imagine it could work.
Both my parents voted against it, and yet I have benefited enormously from it.
I often wonder how things would have turned out differently if the proposition hadn’t passed.
Except you are ranting about the wrong part of prop 13. First homes are not that big of a deal. Yeah, it has problems, but it also has some solutions. But it also counts for second homes! And... commercial properties. Which don't get sold because they are owned by companies that get sold. Fuck that.
I grew up in SF, child, grandchild, & nephew, of teachers. I remember when it passed. My family, their coworkers, even 12 year old me, knew at the time that it was going to be bad. But the longevity & depth of the problems it created, was even worse than we imagined.
yep - it's why my kid's public elementary school is quasi-privately funded by the PTA. We've turned public education in California into one where the haves can help create a nice school but the have-nots are just fucked.
Honest question: I've had online friends in CA since the early 00s, who explained it to me as safeguard that was put in place to avoid things like little old ladies losing their tiny old homes that their late husband had bought for peanuts in the 50s, bc the home is suddenly worth 7 digits & grandma
2/ is on the hook for 10x her social security check in property taxes. Hell, I live in a LCOL city and we still occasionally have this happen, based on fundraisers or petitions I see online "save Miss Georgina from living on the street at age 89". Didn't it work out that way for anyone? The article
