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Maryland is NOT IN THE SOUTH, MOTHERFUCKER www.nytimes.com/2024/06/26/o...

Opinion | Two Governors, Two Visions of a New Southwww.nytimes.com While Maryland embraces egalitarianism, Louisiana veers toward Christian nationalism.

Don't think I knew the Census Bureau thinks the South includes Delaware

Mind-boggling! Seems like with all the questions they ask, they could have asked "Are you in the South?"

We could start asking it maybe if there's a 2030 Census. If.

It’s below the Mason-Dixon, had slavery.

Same goes for a big chunk of New Jersey

Point of order Delaware is not below the Mason-Dixon line. The Mason-Dixon line separates the western edge of Delaware from Maryland. The Transpeninsular Line separates the southern edge of Delaware from Maryland. The Mason-Dixon turns down at the corner near the Twelve-Mile Circle

(the Mason-Dixon line was surveyed from 1763-1767 to settle the land dispute at the heart of Cresap's War between Pennsylvania and Maryland. It has nothing to do with slavery or the Confederacy despite popular conception. MD and DE were both Union slave states on opposite sides of the Mason-Dixon)

omg this got me while i was making some maps last week. what in the world!

This is Mason-Dixon Line erasure.

Also, if you were a slave state until 1865, you're in the South. That's right, fuck you too Delaware

The last slaves in New Jersey weren’t emancipated until the ratification of the 13th amendment!

Just under the wire

I think if your state tried a mad dash for DC when the Civil War broke out, that means the war would never have progressed very far if their dash had succeeded, which sounds like a southern state’s goal to me

The fuck they are. Y’all are stuck with ‘em.

Sorry folks, Maryland's in the South. Census outside should've told you. www.census.gov/library/stor...

South Region Has the Most States: 16 (and District of Columbia)www.census.gov The South Region has eight states and the District of Columbia in the South Atlantic, four states in East South Central and four states in West South Central.

I've literally had people in Richmond try to tell me they are North.

There’s a South vs Deep South conversation to be had, but in no case is the former capital of the Confederacy “North”.

Especially not when that state had 2 of the 3 different capitals of the Confederacy.

There were once 3 capitals of the Confederacy. All three cities now have black mayors. | CNNwww.cnn.com The Confederacy had three capital cities at varying points: Montgomery, Alabama; Richmond, Virginia; and Danville, Virginia. All three cities have black mayors now – quite a change from the Civil War ...

I just want people to listen to Nancy Pelosi speak for 10 seconds and then say that she has a "Southern" accent with a straight face

As someone I know always says, if Frederick Douglass had to escape slavery from there, it’s the south.

Mid(-Atlantic) take

connecticut is the south to me

Massachusetts is the south to me

fair

My enslaved ancestors who left Maryland to cross the Mason-Dixon line for freedom in Chester County, PA would probably disagree. In fact, parts of Southeastern PA feel pretty fricking southern, imo.

There were plenty of sundown towns in the unquestioned North though—public racism was a lot bigger than the South, culturally and geographically

No need to tell me, I grew up there! But a fair amount of Maryland did fight for the Confederacy.

It's at least south-curious. The Mason-Dixon line is the northern border of MD There are parts of every region of Maryland as Southern as any part of Virginia.

Folks from Maryland fought on both sides. C'mon the legislature probably would've voted to secede if not for some creative use of the executive branch.

Culturally Maryland today is kind of exactly the same? Like PG/Howard/Montgomery County and maybe Frederick are in line with acela corridor culture but the rest is like Pennsylvania between Philadelphia and Pittsburgh - Alabama without the kudzu.

I think direct historical references to the civil war aren't enough to make a case about Southern-ness in 2024. Maryland probably was the South in 1855, but a lot of stuff has happened since—including not seceding and integration into the northeast megalopolis—that mean it isn't now

Maryland is not just PG/Howard/Montgomery/Frederick. I was born in Virginia but most of my dad's friends in the 90s were from the sticks of Maryland. There are lots of parts of Maryland that are still culturally more aligned with the south than the acela corridor.

I lived in Maryland 11 years ago. I won custody of my oldest kid in Baltimore county court. I have been from Delmarva to the furthest west points in Maryland. In conclusion Maryland is a land of contacts

But the parts with the large majority of the people in them are not the parts that are more Southern so I think that makes it pretty straightforwardly true that Maryland isn't the South

No they aren’t, dude. Racism isn’t what makes a place Southern, it a culture, and I have seven generations of Texas behind me assuring you that nobody who owns a fucken toboggan and doesn’t have a local style of barebque is Southern.

I grew up in rural central PA, so "Alabama without the kudzu" made me laugh. I've always heard it called Pensyltucky. Our closest neighbor when I was a kid flew the Confederate battle flag over his shed. To your point, some of these boundaries aren't so easily foiled by borders.

Excluding Frederick but including Baltimore City & County, you get 60% of the population, no matter how it looks on a map of land area.

my grandfather, maryland born and raised and descended from one of the original colonial land grant families, would beg to differ. also he was a racist and a huge asshole and it was a whole fucking thing with him and you're correct.

Not the Deep South anyway…

Not any the south. Zero percent any south.

Not when it came to treatment of Black folks.

Heard. Racism isn’t the measure of what’s the South, tho, especially not in 2024. I’ve heard stuff said in public in northern states that would get you shot in Houston.

Notice I said recently (how recently I’ll defer to Maryland Black folks to define), my comment is strictly about the laws and conditions that allowed white people to terrorize Black people like Georgia.

Always, always true. NYT is so bad at geography or culture.

There was a monument to fallen Confederate soldiers on a block I lived on in Baltimore during college

Unfortunately, America is racist from sea to shining sea. NY and PA had the same number of Confederate monuments as MD in 2020 and CA had more. www.businessinsider.in/internationa...

Whose Heritage? Mapwww.splcenter.org Search for live, renamed or removed memorials to the Confederacy—statues, monuments, roads, schools, buildings, bridges, plaques, military bases—in every state.

In West Virginia, as far back as I can remember, people would disagree on whether we were South, and imo Tennessee and Maryland have the same problem. There's no right answer; the people who lived there were fighting about it at the time, and their descendants still are now.

Is Maryland North or South? Yes.